It's also made rather clear that Zuko wouldn't stand a chance against Ozai anyway.

There really is no test. It's all about the quality of the writing, which is more or less subjective.

edited 14th May '12 1:02:16 PM by PerpetualLurker

@steve Apple's former friend sold the copy of the game Apple lent to him.

@ Orion

I don't, but please tell him tanks anyway.

@Blue not really. This show is expecting me to buy Ozai as a dangerous threat. Kinda hard to do that when his MUCH younger son (whom Aang has beaten several times in the past) is capable of standing up to him and capable of knocking him on his ass.

Besides, I was actually expecting Ozai to be, y'know, INTELLIGENT.

It's really sad, because he has my favourite aesthetic

edited 14th May '12 1:03:58 PM by gingerninja666

@Miss Cheerilee. Yes I know. But for said friend to do that requires a physical copy of the game. Again I say it was either the PS3 or the Xbox version.

@Apple: I will. Sorry to here about your losses. Goodness you haven't had a good few weeks. -glomps-

I hate the whole concept of a Mary Sue litmus test. I don't believe there are any inherently bad tropes or concepts, only poor ways of implementing them.

@Ginger:Ozai had no way of seeing the redirection coming, since it was a technique he didn't know existed. Based on the fight Ozai gives Aang later, I would say Zuko would stand little chance against him in a fair fight.

But a blatant Mary Sue can still be a good character. Danearys from ASOIAF scored pretty high on one.

edited 14th May '12 1:05:48 PM by Bluespade

Well. If I recall correctly the Litmus test not only identified bad Mary sues, but blatantly written ones.

I don't really understand Mary sues sometimes. Character traits are character traits right?

edited 14th May '12 1:05:53 PM by Chadaman99

I've never seen Hard Work Hardly Works or The Gift used well

@Blue and we all know how some people feel about her

edited 14th May '12 1:07:06 PM by gingerninja666

@ ginger, except he CAN'T stand up to him, yes he redirected the lighting, but that becuase he know how, something any firebender could do to any amount of lightning if they know how it's done. If Ozai had used fre, Zuko would be cooked.

And no it's not stupid for him to have used lightning, at that point only 2 people in the entire planet know that redirecting it is possible, far as he knew it was impossible.

Zuko got in one lucky shot by catching Ozai by suprise then ran.

But it doesn't make Ozai LOOK good. Surprise attack or not, the Big Bad was STILL knocked on his ass. It's why I DESPISED Azula's introduction too.

Are good introductions so hard to do?

So, as for Pony Fantasy VI, what the flying feather happened to Twilight? She did something with that esper, turned white, and flew off.

@Ginger

Hard Work Hardly Works is great as a villain motivation, because they are jealous of all those who didn't have to brutally work and slave for every scrap of power they could get. It also works to set up characters with a sense of entitlement as a character flaw, making the point where the hard worker actually surpasses all the more devastating to them.

as to Mary Sue litmus test, it's useless. marySue is NOT about traits, abilities etc.. it is about how they are portrayed relative to the rest of the cast, and how the cast effects them. Even THEN it is all about the writting, Through The Eyes Of Another Pony the most blatant a mary sue you could make is the main character, and yet, the writting is so damn good you don't care, yes logicaly you look at it and go...god he's such a Mary Sue, but while reading it you never really FEEL like it. Really the only sure thing that you can use to define a Mary Sue is if them being around renders every single other person/pony near them completely helpless without them.

edited 14th May '12 1:12:13 PM by Seraphem

Thread Hop

Anything interesting happen while I was sleeping/at work?

Nope.

@Ginger:It sounds like you want the bad guys to straight up win whenever they are introduced, which, if they're facing the main characters sort of ruins the plot, and if they're facing some random other guys it makes the act much less impressive and wastes time.

You slept at work?

edited 14th May '12 1:13:39 PM by crowlover

A mary sue is NOT a standard character type. It ONLY applies to characters which ARE written poorly. There are no set guidelines.

It's why mary sues are almost entirely subjective

Eh, not a lot of checks are ticking off, so I decided to stop the Litmus test.

@Crow: Don't I wish. Case in point, now that I'm out of school I'm working full time now, which means I won't get to post here quite as often. I'll still be around in the evenings, though. Although I will be going on vacation with family in a week and a half, and I have no clue if I'll have internet access, so I may vanish for 2 or 3 weeks at the end of May/beginning of June.

again the litmus test are useless. All they are is a list of stuf the bad writers often use when writting Sues. Any and all of them will work fine in the hands of a skilled writer, it's the overall writing, not the character tropes that make a sue a sue.

Going on vacation with your family? Howd'ya get suckered into that?

I have no idea.