So, you want something like a Physical God ?

...wait a minute...

One that actually is worth a damn, that is.

Let's give Luna a try then?

Yes, because the ruler who's most well known for going off the rails and trying to bring about eternal night, and who still doesn't really have a grasp on the culture of the day is clearly the better option. At least Celestia did something, even if it didn't work. That and the subjects at least like her and listen. I get the feeling that swapping over to Luna would cause some issues.

edited 1st May '12 12:53:11 PM by JapaneseTeeth

I don't think that was Luna's fault.

I believe that Discord was responsible for Nightmare Moon.

The Hub just announced an initial order of 13 episodes for season 3 with the possibility of more (actually that is prolly a certainity lol)

See, that's the problem, she was standing right there. While the wasp-zombie-thingie was monologuing to itself, she could have wasily zapped the crap out of her. Sure, it wouldn't have worked because of The Power of Love and shit, but hey, at least bitch would've done something.

Or, when discord was about. All she did was be all like "Girls, Sheoggorath is on the loose. You fix it, I'm too busy to do anything. Here's the McGuffins of Harmony— Oh, wait they're gone, deary me. Go find them, I'll be waiting here. Or something." and that's it.

Though, It's been forever since I've seen that episode, so maybe there was an explanation or something? I can't remember well. Point is, she sucks.

Discord warps reality. Celestia cannot.

How can she compete with that?

No, see, that was all part of the plan. Celestia could have obliterated the Changeling Queen at any moment, and knew of all the scheme since the moment of its inception; but by allowing it to reach its conclusion, she allowed Shining Armor and Cadence to take care of the problem themselves. Taking care personally of all problems is sloppy behaviour for a Physical Goddess, and encourages over-reliance on the part of the subjects; much better to fake weakness and to see if they can solve the issue themselves, while keeping an eye out for potential trouble.

That's essentially the same reason why Luna made herself scarce, by the way.

edited 1st May '12 1:04:14 PM by Carciofus

By doing something else other than staying in her palace? I don't know, helping the six get the elements back, or something. I mean, she then sends twilight the letters, fine, that's useful, but for a character we're meant to believe that is borderline worshiped in its own universe, it's really, really little to do when she could at least try to zap the fucker with a solar blast or some shit.

That's raesonable, except that Canterlot was being Zerg Rushed by a horde of them. Even if it was her plan all along, it didn't quite work well, what with injuries, property damage, chaos on the streets... Not a really good plan.

I mean, I get it, she shouldn't take care of all problems, otherwise everyone would be over depending on her. But, still, look at what happened next.

edited 1st May '12 1:03:31 PM by ThatOneGuyNamedX

By the way, I still maintain that Celestia and Discord are allies and the whole incident of Episodes 1 and 2 was just a way to get the Mane 6 over their insecurities.

Eh. As I said, you cannot solve all the problems of your subjects. Let them take care of the changelings on their own. Plus, they did not kill anypony, and Cadence and Shining Armor's magic fixed everything anyway.

edited 1st May '12 1:03:35 PM by Carciofus

Speaking of which - so I wasn't the only one who thought "Hey, cool! Kerrigan in MLP - no way, she even has her own swarm of Zerg!"

They didn't kill anyone, yes. But no good ruler would put so much of their subjects in danger just to make a point. At least not the ones who flaunt themselves as "kind and loving and all powerful" and shit.

Sure, no one died, but plenty of ponies could've been injured in that whole event. And houses destroyed, places that need to be rebuilt and all. Same with discord, under your theory, in order to help 6 ponies get over their issues, she let a literal madgod do as he pleased with everyone's minds, the lands, etc. That shit is traumatizing.

I'm pretty sure the reason for the whole Discord thing was that she'd fought him before and knew that because he was a Reality Warper, the only thing that could beat him was the EOH. If she was still attuned the elements herself she probably would have done it herself, but that wasn't an option.

As for the monologuing, any Genre Savvy hero knows that if the villain starts listing all the elements of their plan, you listen to it so it'll come back to bite them later. It's not like Celestia would have been any more powerful if she had confronted Chrysalis before the monologue. Taking a few minutes to take stock of the situation and weigh your options isn't exactly a stupid thing to do.

edited 1st May '12 1:11:58 PM by JapaneseTeeth

I'm not sure that Discord was as mad as he presented himself. He talked it big, but the worst that he came up with were chocolate rains, strange scenery, long-legged rabbits, and unpredictable day/night patterns. That's hardly chaos and destruction.

And really, life would be boring without a little trauma once in a while

Yeah I'm with X here. Such behaviour would be plain malovent, and that would be a very, very good reason to have Celestia toppled in a bloody revolution and then have the entire Canterlot court face the guillotine

Personally, I'm a Celestia loyalist. I always liked solar deities.

And in any case, I don't care about omnipotent nannies. That I'd find offensive, and valid grounds for a rebellion.

There's a difference between "not being a nanny" and having your subjects traumatized!

Besides, in the episode Celestia clearly tried to stop Kerrigan, she just sucked at it.

If your president grabbed you, your family, all your friends and your neighbors, and tied you all to a rope at the edge of a cliff to make a point towards 6 people, how would you feel about that person, and their ability to lead?

edited 1st May '12 1:28:28 PM by ThatOneGuyNamedX

Depends. Is my president a powerful entity who is genuinely trying to do the best for everypony? And are those six people the wielders of some incredibly powerful artifact whose power depends on the strength of their relationship, and which in the past proved themselves capable of redeeming a goddess? And did this entity take care that no permanent damage was caused?

That's kind of relevant.*

Plus, not to bring religion into the MLP thread, but the Deity of the religion I profess in Real Life is a bit of a troll Himself

On another topic, did anybody else play A Brony Hero of Equestria? It is quite juvenile, but I will admit I found it pretty funny

To be fair, Chrysalis was juiced up on The Power of Love, and even then, she struggled to beat Celestia.

No, no it really isn't. If the Princess goes around traumatizing people for the sake of some small elite, then the Robespierrean way of dealing with royalty and nobility is called for!

The EOH are not exclusive to them, from what I could tell. Just the fact that they happen to have strong points in those attributes. If so is the case, not only is she endangering everypony else in her little schemes, she's showing favoritism. I mean, I'd get it if she was actually trying to make them into better wielders of the elements, which reminds me of Lord British and the Avatar (another horrendous ruler, I might add), but she doesn't really do anything at all, in the end.

My point: A good "oh so powerful" and crap ruler shouldn't be picking favorites or hoping that their protegés do everything for her. A good queen, princess, whatever, would've at least tried to do crap other than sit around on her fat royal ass and hope for the best. Yes, against chrysalis she was kind of acting up, but any other time she was just hoping too much. Discord? Let him bring down havoc, twist the minds of her subjects, at least the important ones get character development, right?

Who's to know that Celestia did not actually manage to sneak an important lesson for each one of her subjects into these incidents?

You just gotta, well, have faith

Also, the pony inquisition will make short work of any would-be rebels to Her Celestial Majesty.

edited 1st May '12 2:05:37 PM by Carciofus

NOPONY EXPECTS THE PONY INQUISITION!

Eh, Celestia sucks, Luna sucks, Cadence sucks, I still think Sheoggorath Discord should rule. With Derpy as his right hand pony.