He was still himself until... yeah, the vet scene. Even at the doctor's he still looked concerned inbetween the times when he was compulsively grabbing things. Even if he didn't talk.

More like: Magic Negro > Science

edited 11th Dec '11 8:15:36 PM by gingerninja666

So I'm going to have to come out and be contrary to practically everyone I've seen about this, but I didn't really like this episode. It's not that it was bad, just that to me, it was really forgettable. I just rewatched it to make sure, and I just can't recall many scenes. The vet scene, Pinkie's cakes and the Wonderbolts are about the only parts that stick out. I wasn't really expecting much, as Spike is one of my least favorite characters, but I wasn't expecting it to be so...average.

A similar thing happened with Owl's Well. I guess it's really just me not liking Spike. On a more positive note, those capes were really nice and the vet is among the growing list of ponies with "best colour scheme".\

Heh, there's always ONE person who doesn't like the new episode. (same thing happened last week with Rainbow not liking Sweet and Elite, I believe) Don't feel bad about it

Yeah, it's fine if you don't like an episode so long as you aren't rude about it. Love and tolerance, after all.

I'm gonna have to disagree with that. Zecora was using knowledge that she already had; knowledge she had either acquired from personal experience or from studying books made by somepony who had studied it. She didn't just consult her voodoo spirits, or some shit. For that matter, Zecora's potions have always been made exclusively from plants, with no magic involved. Oh sure, the plants were pretty nutty, but they were all-natural. It may be pretty old-fashioned, but Zecora uses science. Not magic.

SCIENCE!

edited 11th Dec '11 8:28:41 PM by kegisak

Zecora is an expert herbalist.

She IS a Magic Negro though

edited 11th Dec '11 8:30:44 PM by gingerninja666

@Kegisak: We'll compromise and say that she exclusively uses plants that have magical properties.

Earth Zebras have the power to draw out the inherant magic inside each plant.

edited 11th Dec '11 8:34:45 PM by gingerninja666

I like to think Zecora is actually a good representation of what Earth Pony (or Zebra in her case) magic is like. It means that they can utilize the magic of plants and animals to their maximum potential, like maybe her potions channel that magic.

edited 11th Dec '11 8:35:12 PM by RhymeBeat

Until she gets a solo episode, I suppose she's a Magical Negro, yes.

...I just don't like the implication that science is always going to be inferior to magic in this setting, like a pony who applies reason is automatically inferior to a pony who just lets things happen and doesn't question it.

... you didn't like Feeling Pinkie Keen then, I take it?

edited 11th Dec '11 8:39:34 PM by gingerninja666

Isn't magic a form of science in My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic? I mean Feeling Pinkie Keen makes it cleared that Twilight understands her magic like a science, and Pinkie was so odd because it deviated from the rules of magic. If one one to charge up the same type of energy consistently and the recorded results were always the same, how is understanding how that works different from magic?

It was not my favourite episode, no.

I'm okay with a setting where there's just plain old no science. I'm okay with a setting where there are both, and each one is treated as roughly equal but differently applicable. I love settings where magic itself is treated as a science. But a setting where reason is always inferior to magic? I hate it.

I could accept Feeling Pinkie Keen as saying that once and a while you need to accept there are things that don't fit your world view, and despite the clearly intended moral I choose to believe that that's what the episode meant. I don't like the implication that just because you don't understand something you shouldn't try to.

Twilight treats it as science, but she's the only one who ever seems to - everypony but her just assumes 'magic is magic', and leaves it at that. And the one time we see Twilight trying to apply reason to it, she's wrong, and "learns" that sometimes it's better to just not understand something. Granted her scientific method was flawed, but that's why I apply my own moral: "If you encounter something outside of your worldview, you shouldn't try to prove it wrong. Accept that it happens, and then go about seeing how it works, rather than trying to disprove it from the start."

edited 11th Dec '11 8:56:05 PM by kegisak

I didn't like the whole predestination (the fact that Twilight accepting Pinkie was FATED to happen, and that Twilight had no choice in the matter) thing, (but that's just me)

or at least that's what it FELT like to me

edited 11th Dec '11 8:48:55 PM by gingerninja666

Maybe I shouldn't have used the word "accent".

(Though, technically, everyone has an accent, in a way.)

Actually, I thought the vet sounded a bit like Spike when she started talking. Might be the same VA.

Rewatching it, I can honestly say that Secret of my Excess' ending is probably the sweetest one in this show's history. Everything after Spike comparing his claw to the print in the ground was gold!

Eh, magic basically takes the place of science in this series; the only time where science science shows up is stuff like Feeling Pinkie Keen when it's more of a gag anyway. And even given Twilight's "scientific method" approach in that episode, she's approaching it as Magic A is Magic A; the whole reason she's investigating Pinkie is because all other magic is internally consistent, and Pinkie's isn't.

She's a Magic Zebra.

I bet the full spectrum of Earth Pony powers hasn't been thoroughly documented.

Apart from enhanced physical attributes, the Royal Canterlot Voice (also used for opera), farming enhancement passives, geology, and the Pinkie Sense, I bet there's more Earth Pony powers yet to be discovered.

Just because Earth Ponies can't fly or cast arcane magic doesn't mean they get the short end of the ability stick.

...Great, now I'm imagining Pegasi playing a high-altitude version of basketball and laughing that Earth ponies can't fly. Cue epic jump and dunk by a lean and mean EP. (You now hear the Space Jam theme playing. C'mon and SLAM!)

edited 11th Dec '11 9:07:46 PM by AceOfScarabs

And she eventually accepts that the Pinkie Sense is a real thing when it's repeatedly, consistently, and uniformly shown to work as she's describing it. That's not blind faith, that's science. She took evidence and modified her theory.

edited 11th Dec '11 9:04:38 PM by Enlong

Wow! I finally caught up with this thread after seeing the episode.

There are 35 pages to go when I started catching up, but that almost doubled while I was reading it! Did you really have to repeat yourself in the exile argument so many times?

edited 11th Dec '11 9:06:20 PM by storyyeller

Yeah the overall idea of the lesson was sound, but the way it was worded was really terrible.

Yeah, the point of the episode wasn't that science was bad, it was more about her attitude. Starting with an end in mind and working to prove it is not how science works. She forgot the whole "fallibility" thing. Not to mention that all of her friends vouch for the Pinkie Sense's accuracy, and she could have simply trusted them.