My only nitpick about the Dune series is that everyone makes too many plans. Murphy's Law just begs to say hello.

Pagetopper :3

edited 28th Jul '12 6:55:38 PM by AceOfScarabs

@Seraphem: That's true, but still, leaving a hole in the story and then retconning in an answer later isn't really a great storytelling method. It can work if you want intentional ambiguity, but I'm not sure that that was the case here.

I don't remember anything much from the second book. The third book is actually a lot more interesting, at least towards the end where Leto turns into a Human Sandworm.

The first Dune book is definitely the best, as far as I'm concerned.

And yes, that first CMC pic is adorable.

@JT: Regardless of your opinon on F:E, you still need to play the Fallout games one of these days. Your missing out by not playing them.

I also wish that this was real.

http://cartoonguy3.deviantart.com/art/My-Little-Pony-Friendship-is-Magic-BRAWL-Scene-303833196

edited 28th Jul '12 6:56:42 PM by marston

Planning is more excusable if you have Super Prescience.

@Marston: I plan to eventually. Then again, I just ordered Valkyria Chronicles, so it might be a while.

And yeah, the first Dune book is the best because there was actually a plot other than "everyone is scheming and then something happens for some reason". The second one kinda lost itself in all the machinations. But hey, at least the series gave us Sandworms.

edited 28th Jul '12 6:57:30 PM by JapaneseTeeth

The first one was definitely the best.

I got the Fallout games. Will play them when I have video game time.

Anyway, can't really put my finger on whether I thought it was terrible or not.

Pros:

• Littlepip wasn't completely unlikable for once.
• Fun twist in the form of birthday cake/card.

Cons:

• Littlepip was still completely unlikable at points.
• Catty relationship drama bullshit. Exactly what the source material was missing.
• Everyone continuing to hero-worship the lead.

edited 28th Jul '12 6:57:59 PM by Pannic

@Seraph Really? What in the world were the chances of that? If the author wanted to write about it, she would have written about it. Otherwise, if she seriously intended the readers to read porn to get the point, then there are even more serious issues here.

@Yeller: At least they have peak-human-intellect Mentats and Spice-high-psychic powers to abuse to justify making that many plans.

My favourite things from Dune are Shai-Hulad, the Crysknife, and some of the neat fantastic-science things like the suspensors (antigrav!), the Holtzmann shields and their catastrophic reaction when you blast them with lasers, and all the neat desert survival tech like the stillsuits and the Wind Traps.

Beep Beep Beep :3 (Warning: Loops, Dangerously Adorable)

edited 28th Jul '12 7:00:40 PM by AceOfScarabs

Eh i don't see it as a hole either way. not stating a characters motivation == them not existing. yeah not great stroytelling to do so unless there's a reason you need to keep it secret, but not a plot hole unless not knowing it makes something not makes sense compared to their other actions.

@Ace: Yeah, but that isn't an excuse to make the story so convoluted that you can't tell what's going on.

That can be a problem if the motivation is important in understanding why a character did what they did, but I never read that far, so I'm just going to drop out of that conversation now.

edited 28th Jul '12 7:00:13 PM by JapaneseTeeth

I can't believe we've been talking about 20.5 filling a hole and no one has made some crude joke.

Kudos to the thread.

@ Lurker, given the the important Character parts are written separately from the porn parts, not hard to just edit those paragraphs out and keep the important stuff. And either way, like i said, not learning Homages motivations for a relationship with Pip was never a plot hole to begin with. bad writing, possibly, plot hole no.

@Badwolf: I already did that a few months back when between me and Ginger we dropped a funny one from Crisis!Equestria Something about Twi's Evil Twin and negating her Void power.

Well I think the bigger problem is that it runs on Unspoken Plan Garuentee. The characters always know what's going to happen but it isn't revealed until the end.

I never read more than a few chapters. I'm starting to think that might have been a good thing, given where this conversation seems to be heading.

@Seraphem Then at least you can understand my problem here. The story is filled with these leaps of logic that are never elaborated on, and the reader is just expected to get it. Some do, and they're the big fans, and some don't. As you said, it's bad storytelling, and there should be nothing wrong not liking a story because of that.

edited 28th Jul '12 7:04:40 PM by PerpetualLurker

@ J teeth agreed, but it's really not that big a deal in his case that not knowing really alters stuff, the only place the CD parts of 20.5 come into play in a big way is Homages reactions to Arbu, and lil'pips reactions to her reaction et al. and that was written LONG after 20.5 was written and accepted as canon.

Agreed, i actually like not having everything always explained in a nice neat package as long as what is missing can be inferred or it's clear there is something there that would make sense if we knew. but yeah not for everyone. And sometimes the writer can slip and not include something important. I just don't think that homages motivations were that big a deal that not including them was a plot hole. And not having every little detail makes a lot of snese for the story given that all we know is what Lil'pip knows, and nothing else. It's just a limitation inherent to the frame of reference choosen.

edited 28th Jul '12 7:08:03 PM by Seraphem

The Harkonnens turn out so absurdly over-the-top wicked I found House Corrino to be more compelling as villains.

Now watching: a Starcraft II LP.

edited 28th Jul '12 7:04:46 PM by AceOfScarabs

I have to admit the Baron was absolutely hilarious in how large of a ham he was. I wish all the characters were that ridiculous.

@ Veni you're missing out, yeah we squabble about the little things with FOE but overall it is a great story, yes it has some issues and could use a professional editor to give it a once over, but the core of the story is amazing. And the early chapters really are the worse, it gets MUCH better quickly after chapter 5-6 and just keeps growing from there

Yeah, ol' Baron H was entertainingly absurd in his wickedness.

I just checked and Everfree got into the Death World list In truth the other Wild Regions outside of colonized Equestria fit the bill too. Froggy Bottom is a soggy place tough to grow crops in, and its infested with Hydras and presumably flies (which the frogs swarm to F.B to feast on presumably), and Ghastly Gorge is a treacherous network of canyons and tunnels inhabited by Quarry Eels.

@Veni

And I would disagree with Seraph entirely, but that's what opinions are for. No one can tell you what to think, and your opinions should be formed on your own.