I disagree with the idea that just because being zany is true to herself means that she shouldn't strive to be less so. I'm naturally apathetic, sarcastic and arrogant as all hell. Should I just 'be myself' at all times anyway? These aren't virtues.

Sigh. Anyway, hi thread. I've been absent because of apathy regarding the topic of Daring Do. Are you mostly finished with that page?

@applelight what?

EDIT: Never mind

edited 18th Feb '12 8:23:18 PM by crowlover

@Fallen: The problem is that he had very good reason to dislike her and refuse her help: She repeatedly humiliated him, destroyed his property, and blatantly ignored his requests to leave him alone. If that happened to me in real life, I wouldn't care if they had good intentions; when somebody breaks into my house and breaks my stuff, I'm calling the cops.

@Arha: Yeah, people forget that "Be yourself" isn't a blank check to not fix your flaws. It refers to things like not being embarrassed about your preferences or interests, not saying "hey, I'm a jerk, so I'm going to be myself and treat people like crap".

edited 18th Feb '12 8:23:34 PM by JapaneseTeeth

Before this goes any further, I'm just going to go ahead and put my argument defending the moral this episode out there, because I honestly think it was handled pretty well.

First of all, by the end of the episode, Pinkie did come to terms with the fact that Cranky didn't want to be her friend. She was just determined to make up for the damage she had caused in the first place. The fact the she went so far as to do some research and actually find Matilda to make it up to him is why he ended up calling her a friend anyway. Second, "you're not allowed to be silly" is a terrible moral, especially when "be yourself, and accept others for who they are" is a core moral of the series. The actual stated moral, which was essentially "some people just want to be left alone, so you shouldn't force yourself on them" really struck a chord with me, because there are plenty of people in my life that I wish would learn that lesson.

Okay, I got my rant out of my system, so there. I do understand the other problems people have with the episode, though. It's just that those don't seem to bother me as much as others.

edited 18th Feb '12 8:23:12 PM by PerpetualLurker

I think being true to yourself is more long the lines of being honest with yourself. If you love others and you are true to yourself you will be fine

edited 18th Feb '12 8:24:09 PM by FallenLegend

@JT This. Look around folks, you have my reasons for disliking Innocent Insensitivity in a nutshell

Ahhh, five seconds into the opening of WORKING!! and I'm already in a better mood. So damn cheerful.

x7 You don't like the page? Or was it all the discussing we've been having about it?

edited 18th Feb '12 8:25:20 PM by TheFreeman

@ crowlover

What's wrong?

@ Lurker

I agree. Yes pinkie screwed up though...but forgiveness seems to be a key theme of this show anyway.

Pinkie is such a Base Breaker this season it seems

@Perpetual: I fully agree with you that the substance of the moral was perfectly fine; In Real Life I like to keep to myself. The problem is that Pinkie never really acted that way and the episode didn't really follow through on it. The problem wasn't solved by Pinkie deciding to give Cranky his space; it was solved by Pinkie pressing on and just happening across the solution.

And I don't think anyone is saying "You aren't allowed to be silly" is a good moral; it's more something like "if you're silliness is annoying someone, you should respect them and not constantly subject them to it".

edited 18th Feb '12 8:27:05 PM by JapaneseTeeth

Pinkie and Rarity are the two most social ponies in different ways. Pinkie is smiles and hugs and singing everywhere, while Rarity is polite and good at conversation and in the know as far as social circles go. The thing is that Pinkie is far more informal about her socialising.

Also, I still say she owes Cranky a couple huge favors at least.

Well, I don't think her personality is a blight. Or/And it's a positive force.

Oh, I'm not saying Pinkie didn't screw up. Hell, Pinkie knew she screwed up and tried to make up for it.

edited 18th Feb '12 8:29:38 PM by PerpetualLurker

I really don't see how anyone can actually hate ANY pony. They all have there flaws, yes but deep down they are all intrinsically good and well meaning. Sorry but I place a lot more weight on a person/pony's intent, while they may make mistakes, and do the wrong thing often, there hearts are always in the right place.

Are they perfect, hell no, but they try there best, when push comes to shove, they will always do what they feel is right. Pinkie included, yes she can be annoying, and has severe issues understanding any thought process that isn't in sync with hers. But if any pony is in trouble, or hurting, sad, lonely, anything, she will not rest until shes has done everything within her power to help, and never require anything in return.

^^^^^^^^ I'm pretty indifferent, meaning that when the thread was discussing it so much I had nothing to contribute. Since the thread was discussing it for a couple days at least...

edited 18th Feb '12 8:27:01 PM by Arha

@applelight a post of yours had an arrow pointing down before there was a post there. It confused me, though it was somewhat random to ask.

@Jt I admitt that pinkie went too far in some parts, that eve twilight had to face-book.

I think a big factor is that pinkie didn't knew ow to handle someone not wanting her friendship

@Lurker. What JT said, plus, Pinkie still got what she wanted in the end. She'll still be insistant upon making everypony she meets her friend, because so far, everyone IS her friend, even Cranky.

There WILL be people whom Pinkie can't help, even if she gives them space. All she's learned is: "If I can't make them my friends this way. I CAN make them my friends in another way."

edited 18th Feb '12 8:29:53 PM by gingerninja666

Good intentions only take you so far. It was obvious from the beginning that Cranky wanted nothing to do with her. And she couldn't respect that.

And yeah, broken aesop is broken.

edited 18th Feb '12 8:28:49 PM by Arha

Yeah, didn't say much when we were talking about the Daring Do page for like a whole freakin' day, due to lack of ideas....

Not that I mind. Shows that we're a relatively creative bunch.

edited 18th Feb '12 8:28:51 PM by TheFreeman

I agree 100% Seraphem.

I don't think that is a safe thing to assume.

And as others have said, intentions don't really negate your actions.

edited 18th Feb '12 8:29:56 PM by Mio

I don't see why the lesson learned has to be the solution to the problem. In fact, there have been plenty of episodes where the solution to the problem has been something completely separate from the moral, but the lesson learned is about what caused the problem in the first place.

Not that the ending wasn't contrived, it totally was, but it doesn't undermine the moral at all IMO.

edited 18th Feb '12 8:30:52 PM by PerpetualLurker

@speraphem

I totally agree with you. I mean Pinkie invited him to spa and bought her a new toupe with Rarity!.

Who pays you an spa visit after he/she just met you

Pinkie handled the situation badly but she definitively had good intentions.